Preview Mode Links will not work in preview mode

Dec 6, 2022

John and Craig welcome Daniels, writing-directing duo Dan Kwan and Daniel Scheinert (Swiss Army Man, Everything Everywhere All at Once) to discuss making big, ambitious movies. The filmmakers share their process of chasing challenging ideas and the importance of novelty seeking.

We also talk about having faith in your future self, bravery, the narrative structure of pop songs, and idea generation as a fish net.

In our bonus segment for premium members, we learn about directing music videos and the unlikely flashpoint of many of their ideas. (It’s Maroon 5. No really, it is and you have to hear the explanation.)


Email us at

You can download the episode here.